Conversations: 1951

January 8, 1951

MEMORANDUM FOR THE FILE

SUBJECT: Conversation with Dr. Lee DuBridge

Dr. DuBridge called me this morning and asked me to have lunch with him, which we did for about an hour and a half at the Pentagon. On his mind were the events of the last few days concerning the National Science Foundation directorship and the creation of a Scientific Adviser to the President.

Dr. Conant had spoken with him after he, Dr. Conant, had called on the President, and told me of the interview in which Dr. Conant, obedient to the instructions of the NSF of which he is Chairman, presented first the name of Dr. Bronk and, as I was told, that the President nodded approvingly and carried the ball from that point. DuBridge, who is also a member of the NSF, made it quite clear, even clearer than Dr. Conant himself had done in his rather guarded comment when he met with Messrs. Staats, Stauffacher, and myself etc. on Friday just before his call to the President -- he made clear that Dr. Conant’s own views were considerably different from those of the sense of the 24-man board. As DuBridge put it, '‘things just snowballed." Apparently, therefore, Dr. Conant as Chairman did not have the meeting under as close control as one might have looked for. His task was complicated, of course, by the relations between him and Dr. Bronk growing out or the action of the National Academy last spring and by the general acclaim for Dr. Bronk as a person.

At any rate, the Board agreed on a slate of 10 names and instructed Dr. Conant to present the first three and then in his judgment if none of these subsequently proved suitable to the President, to advance a second panel of four, and then apparently finally the additional three. The first three names were Bronk, L. Baird Hastings of Harvard, and Lloyd Berkner [Carnegie Institution of Washington], in that order. As I was previously informed, Bronk had said that he would take the job only if it encompassed military scientific activities as well. DuBridge was quite clear about the incompatibility of programmatic military research for the purpose of the National Science Foundation, and his views and mine are completely in accord. He also said that Dr. Conant was pretty clearly of these views. He told me that there is a trustees meeting of Hopkins being held today at which Dr. Bush will be present, and which he thought it quite possible that Bronk would discuss these matters with the trustees.

DuBridge has been urged by many people to undertake the Scientific Adviser to the President if he is asked to do so. It would be very difficult for him, however, to devote more than half his time to this undertaking. He probably could devote about half his time to it, primarily by dropping off virtually all other non-Cal Tech activities, but beyond that would involve some major arranging. I learned from other sources that he has some difficulties with his trustees and apparently it would be no simple matter, both by reason of the trustees relationship and by reason of the status of his organization, for him to devote, say, 90 percent of his time to it.

I brought up the committee matter and mentioned that, after suggesting that there be an advisory committee to the Scientific Adviser or perhaps that he be chairman of a defense scientific committee to the President or something such as that, there be a supporting committee consisting of, say, the Chairman of the Research and Development Board, the President of the National Academy of Sciences, and the Chairman or Director of the National Science Foundation. I mentioned that Conant had indicated approval of this thought, his indication being reinforced by his suggestion at his meeting with us at the Budget Bureau last Friday -- by his suggestion of the addition of the Chairman or the General Advisory Committee of the AEC (Oppenheimer). DuBridge expressed full approval and said it might be well to add Mervyn Kelly [Bell Telephone Laboratories] to the committee. I asked him why, and he said, well as a representative of industry and that he was very highly esteemed. Then he also said that General Saville, RDB member from the Air Force, had, in discussing this general subject with DuBridge within the last few days, said that there ought to be, say a 3-man group, of whom one should be DuBridge, another Kelly, and the third he was not sure. DuBridge also suggested that possibly there should be a full-time executive officer who would spend full time in Washington, and that this executive officer might. for example, be Dr. Wheeler Loomis [fomerly Assistant to DuBridge at MIT Radiation Laboratory].

William T. Golden